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Kicking around the "car shows"
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Posted by: An11SecRanger

Quote:

Originally Posted by StoneFox


	This is the same shit as the Chopper shows...

This post (from the Unique Whips thread) got me thinkin' ...
I think I agree with you. At least, I think I agree with your point.
Chip Foose daMAN! ya gotta give him credit for being one of the greatest in his business. IMHO, he's in a class of his own. He has great ability to visualize and to bring his vision to fruition. He seems better at that than most.

Then there's Jesse James. I didn't care much for his show, but I respect his abilitah! That guy can do some kickass work with metal. I'm a (halfass compared to Jesse) welder/fabricator. And I can say from the point of view of someone who works with metal every day, Jesse is a great fabricator.
So I didn't mind his show being what it was.

Most of the "bike builders" have talent. I could live without all the drauma on the OCC show. If I gave my dad that kind of attitude (no matter how well I could dream up new things) he'd have kicked my ass, right there, in front of God and everybody! End of STORY!
But, like I said, "most bike builders have talent." And guys like Vinnie and Rick have talent, so I can live with that show.

I think Boyd wanted to do his show in spite of Chip. There's bad blood there!
The problem with Boyds show is Boyd! He's like a waling zombie. But he has an arrogance about him that only someone like Chip (who doesn't seem arrogant) could carry.
Boyd doesn't seem to know what he's doing at all. Most of his stuff is junk, IMO. I would drive, much less pay the ridiculous price he asks for, most everything he's ever done.
I think his awards are tokens from rich people who just feel sorry for him.
The worst thing about him is probalby the amount of work he expects from his employees and then treats them with little to no respect! It makes it easy to decide he hasn't really "done" this stuff for a long time.

Duane makes himself look like an asshole on a regular basis and he's NOT that good at fabbing. He talks a big game, but when it's time to *do* the thing, he's at a loss. He good at telling other to do things, but he never seem to do much more than wiring and he sucks at that.

Roy was a great metal worker.

Al is a great metal worker. Of course, he quit once.

What's his name (the painter)? ... Charlie ... Right? He was a good employee, but too smart to stick around and be kicked around any longer, so he's gone.

Overall, Boyd Coddington's Hot-rods' empoyees are pushed too hard and usually end up bolting (and welding) together store-bought parts (everything from frames/panels to wiring). They don't seem to "make" much of anything. Hell, I've been doing that in my garage for years. Big deal!

Unique Whips is even worse. I haven't seen any talent there. They hired a guy from LA (flooded out by katrina, or something) and he told 'em their work sucked and they ran him off.
I guess that poor guy had never watched to show before.

I mean, if he thought they were doing high quality work there, he COULDN'T have seen it before!

And don't even get me started on what's been going on on Spike TV. Where the heck is Stacey David? What the heck are they trying to do, get out of the business?
Well, I guess Xtreme4x4 is pretty good. Ian knows his stuff. and jessi knows her stuff and she's ... Yeah, that.

Let's just say, I could spend my days in the shop with her.
And Horsepower is still pretty good. I like that fact that they dyno test so many different things.
However, Musclecar (while it is getting better) and the new trucks, I can live without.

Who else wants to bash?

Posted by: StoneFox

Yeah they ruined Trucks, it was my favorite of all the 'Spike TV' shows when Stacy was on it. He built some VERY nice rides, and a novice could actually learn from him. The new guys suck, I think one of them is a homo and the other a WWE reject.

And yeah the Extreem 4x4 chick is a knock out

Posted by: skeezix

The thing about OCC,if they built rods instead of bikes, I watch it.

Boyd sucks, pimp my ride sux, never saw rides(couldn't care less by the look of the vehicles, monster garage and Jessie's attitude was kinda cool.

Chip Foose is undoubtably the man, the overhaulin-prank-thing is gay however.

Posted by: StoneFox

Quote:

Originally Posted by skeezix


	The thing about OCC,if they built rods instead of bikes, I watch it. Boyd sucks, pimp my ride sux, never saw rides(couldn't care less by the look of the vehicles, monster garage and Jessie's attitude was kinda cool. Chip Foose is undoubtably the man, the overhaulin-prank-thing is gay however.

Rides is pretty cool. Its a different car builder every time so ofcourse your gonna get a few duds, but they have had Foose, and Rad Rides by Troy on there so it evens out.

Posted by: TNT

I've got to agree with Boyd. IIRC his Riddler should be Chip's. Foose designed and built that car while working for Boyd. All the crappy Boydsters that Coddington's been putting out since then are cheap attempts at immitating that car. I don't understand why anyone with any talent sticks around. Although, I think the only decent guy he's got now is Al, who left and screwed up and returned.

I actually like the Overhaulin concept. How many of us could take our car to Foose and afford to pay him to make it kick ass? What I don't like is how they keep finding excuses to do cars for celebrities, people who can afford to hire Foose if they want to. So far they've done cars for Ian Ziering, Lance Armstrong, A friend Of JAy Leno's, a friend of Charlie Sheen's, Nick Lachey's brother, CNN this week, and a friend of Vince Neil's. How about going back to hooking up some of us who need the help instead of the celebrity du jour?

I actually see some parallels between OCC and Boyd's shop. Imagine how fucked Sr would be if Paulie JR left to open his own shop. The only difference being that there's a blood relationship there to keep it from happening. Boyd thought that CHip would be so eternally grateful for a job and being allowed to crash at Boyd's house that he'd work there forever.

Posted by: skeezix

Yeah, funny how you mentioned the "celebrity du jour" thing. Like Nick Lahey's brother is broke.

They should scout the country, keeping an ear to the ground, finding "half-done" projects that are sitting in peoples' yards/garages/ barns because they can't afford to finish them, and opt to award someone an "overhaul package" through a draw or some shit.

It keeps it real, and makes the general public love foose even more.

Posted by: TNT

Hell, I've emailed them to nominate 4 different cars in my family.....none of them mine. NEver heard back. The show's website used to have a form to fill out to get a car on, I haven't checked in months to see if that's still there.

Who wouldn't want to see Foose do my brother's 65 F100 stepside, formerly owned by our grandfather? Or my uncle's 47 Chevy sedan, originally owned by my great-grandfather and rotting in a garage since the 80s? Or his 77 Vette, he vowed to own one before he turned 25 and bought that car for his 24th birthday and kept it ever since. Or my aunt's 65 Mustang fastback, she's the original owner. Her husband, not the 47 owner, has been promising to rebuild it for 10 years but can't because arthritis has twisted his hands into claws that can barely hold a wrench these days.

but instead of fixing these cars they hookup celebrities and their friends.

Posted by: John

I have to say that in defense of Boyd Coddington, he really did start out doing it himself. He's much older now though and not so capable. He's 62 and not in the best of health. He started with his shop in 1977 and is a trained machinist too. He actually did do the work and by the time Foose came along, Coddington took his little garage shop to the level of the premier hot rod builder. Foose was a feather in the cap and really didn't have that much to do with Boyd building his shop up. Foose was an integral part, no doubt, but Hot Rods by Boyd was famous and established long before Foose showed up.

Some info on Boyd Coddington
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyd_Coddington

Some info on Chip Foose
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chip_Foose

As far as personal commentary, yeah, Coddington acts like a jackass. I can't really say he's arrogant because most of the guys he has working with him were barely out of diapers when he started doing this work. He can talk the talk because he already walked the walk. On the other hand though, I can't help but wonder how much of that "persona" is attributed to creative editing for the show? I mean, they are trying to get good TV and good TV pretty much revolves around conflict and strife for most people. Personally, I'd rather watch them build cars.

Duane has the arrogance. I don't think he's a good shop manager and I don't think he's all he makes himself out to be. I can't deny the fact that he is in a spot where I only wish I could be. Other than that, he's hot headed but has a bit of a base in reality. He brings levity to the shop, believe it or not.

Charlie was Boyd's body guy and IMO opinion, one of the best damn painters I ever saw. He was wizard with the prep work and his paint jobs showed it. It was a sparkling talent that Boyd's over-bearing demeanor drove off. Couple that with the insane work schedules that were demanded and I can see why he left. I don't know for sure where he went to but last I saw, he was working with Chip Foose. Boyd got lucky signing Bernt (sp?) up to work for him. He's just good at whatever he touches. Boyd's interior shop Gabe's is incredible too! Al and Roy, it's obvious they know what they are doing.

The person I really can't stand is Boyd's wife Jo. She gets on her high and mighty horse and lords over the employees and for what? Because she's Boyd's wife? What the hell did she do to deserve her position besides get busy bumpin' uglies with Boyd? Shut her trap up, throw her in the back office where she belongs and don't let her busted mug or his troll of an ex-wife ever see the camera lens again.

Now, Chip Foose's Overhaulin', that show rules just by the sheer fact that EVERYONE in the industry except for Boyd loves Chip Foose. I like to watch the show just for the chance to see the best names in the industry build a car for someone. It's like getting a chance to see DaVinci paint the Mona Lisa or, Ed "Big Daddy" Roth work his magic.

Rides is a good show too and it's not just about a build up. It's a show about the car culture completely and every aspect of it. Add to that the fact that it's hosted by Jason Priestly...yeah, I know, a pretty boy...and it wins serious points. Jason wins points because as much as his "pretty boy" mug was his meal ticket, he chose to go racing and busted up his "pretty boy" mug in the name of speed and competition. That scores serious man points in the man book!

Now, OCC, that show is all editing. I actually got a chance to meet Junior, Vinny and Senior in AC one year. They are nothing like what the show portrays them as. Yeah, they were ribbing each other just like any other guy would with his buddies or brothers but we all do that. It's how guys work. One thing was sure, as much as Senior and Junior fight on the show, that is one proud father. His boys are his life and he's proud to have them. I also think that Senior may not have the success without Junior but I know he could do it. He built that shop from the ground up in a shack out behind his metal fabricating shop...which he still runs. There is alot more talent in that family that the TV show leads you to believe. Senior is lucky to have a few of the best guys I've seen building motorcycles in Vinny and Rick but, if you look past all the BS the TV show edits for "good TV", you can see it's a family business. I mean hell, Paul Sr, Paul Jr and Mikey RE-ROOFED VINNY'S HOUSE WHILE HE WAS ON VACATION!!!!! My boss wouldn't pick me up on the side of the road if I had a flat tire let alone re-roof my house. They are stand up guys and just flat out good people. They have fun at work and I applaud that. Could the tempers be dialed back a bit? Sure but they got to where they are being good at what they do. The TV show only gave them more exposure. OCC is the real deal and deserve to be ranked among the best bike builders in the country.

As far as Spike TV, I don't even watch it anymore. The Extreme 4x4 show is the only one worth watching left. TRUCKS! used to be all I watched on Sunday. Now they got those two goobers there because Stacey David didn't want to take the show where the network wanted it to go. So Stacey David left and is working in a new show apparently. You can get more info here:

http://www.staceydavid.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stacey_David

Stacey David has my unending respect and admiration. He's a regular guy showing the regular guys that it is "just that easy" and that "you CAN do this yourself" so "go out there and DO IT!" I learned alot watching him and his enthusiasm seems over-bearing and insincere at times but I really feel that was editing too. His enthusiam is contagious and I really hope he does get another show on another network. Even if I have to upgrade the cable subscription, I'll be watching it.

The rest of the shows? BAH! I say! BAH! Sure, the chick on Extreme 4x4 is nice looking and she can fabricate and everything but the show is about things I'll likely never do on rigs I'll likely never be able to afford and uses very advanced techniques and design that one would need to actually go to school for to learn how to do properly. The other shows, they were OK at best. The MuscleCar show was GREAT it's first season then the one dude left. I can't even remember what his name was but I know he worked for Troy Trepanier before he did the show. He was awesome to watch and I learned alot from him too. The Lou guy is funny to watch but with out the other guy, the show lacks substance IMO.

Now, the doozie! Unique Whips! I'll say that I can appreciate the work that Remy does. He acts like a punk ass but I've seen him do some very nice work for the audio systems. They also had an upholstery guy who was spectacular at one point. He left though. As far as Castro goes, he gets on my nerves. He's more interested in pressing the flesh with his celebrity clients than anything. He also never takes any of his guys who do the work with him. That bugs me too because it's like he's not giving any credit where it is due. There is no doubt that he worked up from being a lowly detail shop in a gas station to what he is now and I'll give credit for that. It ain't easy to do at all. However, they market themselves almost as a "tuner" shop but they have zero automotive know-how or talent in the performance market at that shop at all. I mean, while they did use KOOKS Kustom Headers to do the exhaust on 50 Cent's armored SUV, all they had to do was unbolt the system from the catalytic converter and bolt the new parts on and they couldn't even do that. I think KOOKS was overkill because they make some nice stuff and almost everyone I know running Outlaw Street in this area is running KOOKS Kustom Headers. Seems like a waste of thier talent on a cat-back exhaust but, whatever.

As far as the rides coming out of Unique Whips, garish in most cases, unnoticable in others. Wheels and tires with big, junk subwoofers and amplifiers and these celebrities are getting gouged on it too. But, if you got the money to blow and all you want in that Unique Whips signature then give me 10 grand and I'll buy whatever Sharpie marker color you want and put UW anywhere you want on the car.

The shows on The Speed Channel just got real sad after Speedvision got bought out. Shadetree Mechanic was neat to watch and very informative. It was always product centric but now it's a 30 minute advertisment with real bad actors. I miss Dave Bowmen. Dream Car Garage is a Canadian program so that explains that. It's neat to watch for the sheer value of seeing the restored cars. The chopper shows suck and are painful to watch. The only redeeming value to NOPI TunerVision is the scantily clad host and coverage of bikini contests and even then that can be disappointing.

On Discovery, Monster Garage started out neat and got craptastic real quick as soon as they determined that the rules didn't matter anymore. The Biker Build Off shows are tedious anymore and seem like re-hashed crap now. They are digging up any schmuck with a bike shop now it seems. The best part about BBO was Indian Larry but that dumb ass killed himself screwing around on his motorcycle, showing off. The specials they did on Jesse James were very cool and I was glad to see a builder I was following for a while finally get the exposure he deserved.

Well, that's pretty much my view for now. If I think of any thing else, I'll add more later.

Posted by: TNT

I think the problem with the new guys on the Spike TV shows is that they hired too many painters. The guy from Trepanier's that was on Muscle car and left was Troy's painter. So what does he offer the audience when the cars aren't ready for paint? Same with the new guy on trucks. The non-roids user is the guy who painted Copperhead and several of Stacey David's other projects. Again, doesn't really mean he's got any business there during the fabrication steps.

I kind of blocked Spike's shows from my mind when I made my last post. But the Trucks goobers are now doing one of my biggest pet peeves as a project. Namely, throwing a SBC into a F100! BLASPHEMY! Keep the chevy motors in the chevies, Fords in the Fords, Dodge in the dodges, and ALL of the above are better than fucking imports.

Posted by: John

Quote:

Originally Posted by TNT


	I kind of blocked Spike's shows from my mind when I made my last post. But the Trucks goobers are now doing one of my biggest pet peeves as a project. Namely, throwing a SBC into a F100! BLASPHEMY! Keep the chevy motors in the chevies, Fords in the Fords, Dodge in the dodges, and ALL of the above are better than fucking imports.

Stacey was going to do that originally with the Hairy Hauler and stuff a 383 Chebbie engine under the hood. Then he changed it to a Mopar RB383 crate motor. Then he went and found that 331 Hemi from 1955 jammed that Hilborn injector system on to it.

The Hairy Hauler is an International though so it doesn't matter what engine it has in it, it likely isn't an International engine. I'm pretty sure they outsourced thier engines to Ford, GM and Chrysler. I could be wrong though.

Posted by: An11SecRanger

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	I have to say that in defense of Boyd Coddington, he really did start out doing it himself. He's much older now though and not so capable. He's 62 and not in the best of health.

I wouldn't call 62 old, at all.
If his health is failing, I can't rag on him for that.
Whatever the reason, he certainly seems incapable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	He started with his shop in 1977 and is a trained machinist too.

And since '77 he's done what? 5-10 different "looks"? It just all seems to be the same crap, over and over. And I don't like much of what he's done. tha's just my taste, though.
Chip seems to have about a million different "looks" to his work. And even the one's that are similar still stand on their own merit.
As far as Boyd being a trained machinist goes; do you remember the episode when he was making (I can't remember what) a peice on a lathe and Blue-bear was scared? ... And, sure enough, Boyd screwed up and the part went fying off the lathe). He didn't look like a trained machinist to me. But, I admit, the part got made and it did work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	He actually did do the work and by the time Foose came along, Coddington took his little garage shop to the level of the premier hot rod builder. Foose was a feather in the cap and really didn't have that much to do with Boyd building his shop up. Foose was an integral part, no doubt, but Hot Rods by Boyd was famous and established long before Foose showed up.

I'm not saying Boyd shouldn't be in business. I'm saying he's not very good at it and "just because he used to be" isn't enough to make me want his stuff.
Chip might have been a feather in the cap back then, but today, he's a soaring eagle for the entire industry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	As far as personal commentary, yeah, Coddington acts like a jackass. I can't really say he's arrogant because most of the guys he has working with him were barely out of diapers when he started doing this work. He can talk the talk because he already walked the walk. On the other hand though, I can't help but wonder how much of that "persona" is attributed to creative editing for the show? I mean, they are trying to get good TV and good TV pretty much revolves around conflict and strife for most people. Personally, I'd rather watch them build cars.

From my point of view, Boyd acts more like a friggin moron than a jackass. To me, he just seems to be at a loss when it's time to make a desision.
The times I think he's acting like jackass is when he takes credit for the good stuff his guys produce when, in reality, he didn't have much, if anythig, to do with it.
And remember when he was bragging about the "mystery painter"? That was just sad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	Duane has the arrogance. I don't think he's a good shop manager and I don't think he's all he makes himself out to be.

I agree!

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	he's hot headed but has a bit of a base in reality. He brings levity to the shop, believe it or not.

Yep, he's hot headed, alright. And I can see your point about him having a bit of a base in reality ... Except when he says stupid shit like how *HE* could have had it done already. Ususally, I say that's bull shit. He's not as good as he thinks he is.
Levity?

Well, in a strange way.
But, I think he pisses people off more than he makes them laugh. It seems as though, his humor, most often, come at the expense of someone else. I admit it is humor. But when he has to make someone else feel like an ant, is it really worth it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	the chick on Extreme 4x4 is nice looking and she can fabricate and everything

I think Jessi is cute. I mean, if I saw her in a mall

But, it's the whole package that I dig! I good looking "chick" who can fab is not something most people will see everyday! All I see everyday, is guys who can fab. But, she'd be graet to have around! I'd have her with me all the damn time!

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	but the show is about things I'll likely never do on rigs I'll likely never be able to afford and uses very advanced techniques and design that one would need to actually go to school for to learn how to do properly.

I've never seen them do anything I haven't done. I'm sure, I missed something but, what I've seen them do, is stuff I've done.
I totally can get in to that show.
The shitty part is, we don't all have the killer tools they have. In all the fab shops I've worked at, none of them had all the stuff they have used. I'd prolly have to go to 3-4 shops to do all the work they do on that show.
And I can't afford some of those rigs either (the reason I don't have a 4x4 toy [money pit!]). But there are people out there who can and most of them can't do the work, so guys like me get paid to do it for them and that's a good thing!
I went to the scoool of hard knocks and low pay to learn what little I know and I'm still learning every day. And I still get the low pay, too. DAMIT!

Quote:

Originally Posted by John


	other shows, they were OK at best. The MuscleCar show was GREAT it's first season then the one dude left. I can't even remember what his name was but I know he worked for Troy Trepanier before he did the show. He was awesome to watch and I learned alot from him too. The Lou guy is funny to watch but with out the other guy, the show lacks substance IMO.

I didn't think MuscleCar was great, even during the first season.
I think Lou's pretty funny and he really loves what he's doing (I like the Nova project).
I think the direction of the show is south. That's sad.

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