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GUN RIGHTS UPHELD!!!!
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Posted by: Grape Ape

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080626..._co/scotus_guns

FINALLY!!! The Supreme Court gets one right!!!

Posted by: Brootal

Whatever the Constitution may say, it's clearly too easy for fuckwits, criminals and unstable people to get hold of firearms in the USA. Kids taking multiple firearms to school and shooting the shit out of people? WTF?

Posted by: No Rice Allowed

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brootal


	Whatever the Constitution may say, it's clearly too easy for fuckwits, criminals and unstable people to get hold of firearms in the USA. Kids taking multiple firearms to school and shooting the shit out of people? WTF?

It's even easier to get a hold of a car and alcohol, then crash it into a crowd. For every news event you hear about from a gun related death, I assure you, there are many that go unnoticed about someone saving their life by having a gun. Unruly children today, don't need a gun to kill, a baseball bat can be sufficient. Improper upbringing and to much medication, is killing are children. Everytime you turn around some kid is diagnosed with some sort of ailment and is treated with hostile drugs. An emotional rollercoaster effect when the drugs wear off. I don't remember growing up and really ever hearing about so many kids being treated with ADD/ADHD, Anxiety, Bipolar, Depression, and so on....HRS Doesn't Help either...You spank you child for doing something wrong in public and some person calls HRS on ya.

Posted by: John

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brootal


	Whatever the Constitution may say, it's clearly too easy for fuckwits, criminals and unstable people to get hold of firearms in the USA. Kids taking multiple firearms to school and shooting the shit out of people? WTF?

The operative word there being "criminal". Criminals don't obey laws, that is why they are criminals. Whether guns are allowed or not criminals will still get them because guns are power and to do what they do needs power. The laws will not change that because they are already written to help prevent that and it does nothing but add some level of accountability.

There is no logic in outlawing guns for the common, law abiding citizen when they aren't the ones committing the crimes.

There are millions of common, decent people in the country that own guns. Some own multiple guns and we have a civilized society capable of doing great things and living in peace and our crime rate is no different than any other 1st world country. Taking away the right to own a gun will only make it easier for a criminal to affect a crime because then there is even less resistance than there is now.

This country has laws and any society needs laws to be a society. But for all intents and purposes, we are a free country and you can choose your own path here without reserve. Unless of course you have an intent to hurt others in some way. Then someone will put a stop to you. But you can say what you like, do what you like, buy a car, buy a gun and buy beer all in the same afternoon and you are free to make good or bad decisions about what you do or how you use those items and in what order you do so. It is left up to you to understand what the morally right things to do are because it is expected that you should know better if you are old enough to purchase all three. If you make poor decisions concerning those items, you are free to do so but they come with penalties. If you make the morally right decisions, there is no problem and the law enforcement people won't even give you a second look.

Does that give us a higher possibility of crime? Maybe. But it is not my place to tell my fellow American what he/she can/can't do with their lives nor is it theirs to do the same to me. So I keep my guns and I enjoy my guns and I don't shoot people, not even if they really deserve it. I have committed no crime and I, for one, do not see it fair to punish me for the acts of criminals. I'm glad the Supreme Court agrees with me. It helps restore a small modicum of faith in "the system" and it's ability to do something good.

Posted by: Grape Ape

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brootal


	Whatever the Constitution may say, it's clearly too easy for fuckwits, criminals and unstable people to get hold of firearms in the USA. Kids taking multiple firearms to school and shooting the shit out of people? WTF?

It is clearly too easy, but we can't take away the rights of 300 million plus people because 2 million of them may break the law.

Even so, today you can't just go buy a gun in most states. You go pick one out and pay and WAIT 2 weeks while a background check is done and you're verified and in many cases, fingerprints are also required. And we have guns available today which are pretty safe. We must remember, a gun never killed a person, a person holding a gun did. The gun cannot discriminate, but people can. The constitution was upheld and this "gun battle" has been going on for 3 decades. Thankfully, it has been more carefully ruled on.

Washington D.C. was violating civil rights since what, 1976? Long time for a group of politicians to hold hostage, the rights of millions of people. And while that rule was in place for all those years, D.C. held the title for "most gun murders" in America several times in yr by yr studies. So preventing citizens from owning guns left guns in only the hands of criminals... Who used them. Now the tables may be turned and at least the citizens have a chance they didn't have for many years. This will surely save lives.

Posted by: Slow Nova

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brootal


	Kids taking multiple firearms to school and shooting the shit out of people? WTF?

Teach kids about guns & take them shooting. They will be much more likely to respect the firearm, and at the same time take out some aggression and have some fun. It's good therapy. Also, keep the gun securely locked away when not in use, then your kids won't have access to them when they're not supposed to. If your kid happens to get a gun illegally - well then gun laws would not have done anything to prevent that.

My wife and her parents had been anti-gun most of their lives. I started hunting a couple years ago, and my wife didn't like the fact that there was going to be a gun in the house. A few trips to the range, and now she, and her parents are hooked. In fact, she's a recoil junky; she loves shooting my Remington 870 12ga shotgun, and my Remington 700 30-06. She doesn't like shooting my Marlin 60 .22lr, because it's "too wimpy".

Posted by: 65fairlane

If guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.

A couple of years ago I got my dad a 22 semi-auto pistol for christmas. In about 45 minutes I was walking out of the store with it. Most of that time was spent picking it out.

Posted by: Grape Ape

Quote:

Originally Posted by 65fairlane


	If guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns. A couple of years ago I got my dad a 22 semi-auto pistol for christmas. In about 45 minutes I was walking out of the store with it. Most of that time was spent picking it out.

Had you purchased a gun before? Can you still buy one so easily?

In FL, they say you can't do that. Gotta wait for any pistol purchase through a regular store. I think you can still get instant delivery at gun shows though. Never bought one that way.

I like Ohio's rule better personally.

Posted by: Slow Nova

Quote:

Originally Posted by 65fairlane


	A couple of years ago I got my dad a 22 semi-auto pistol for christmas. In about 45 minutes I was walking out of the store with it. Most of that time was spent picking it out.

Not out here in CA.

Long Guns: 11 day waiting period.
Handguns: 11 day waiting period AND Only one handgun in any 30 day period.

And in Sacramento, if you want to purchase ammo, you need to give the store your personal information and get fingerprinted.

Now, I can understand the waiting period for someone who doesn't have any firearms, and someone could be purchasing a firearm 'in the heat of the moment'...but for someone who already has a collection of firearms at home, it makes absolutely no sense, whatsoever.

Posted by: 65fairlane

It was at a regular gun store, not a show or anything. They also serve law enforcement agencies so I doubt they are doing anything too shady. I had never bought a gun before or after that. It was December of 2006, and I don't recall any significant law changes since then, but that doesn't mean there haven't been any.

Posted by: bigjhaire

When the government takes away your guns you are in deep sh--..
Do not give up your gun rights...
It is unfortunate that a few Idiots have used guns for the wrong reasons.
I do not want to live in a country that doesnt give me the right to protect my family and myself.

GOD BLESS AMERICA....

Posted by: Brootal

I understand a lot of those sentiments, and I don't have an issue with guns, in fact I quite like shooting inanimate objects (I prefer to get my meat pre-packed

) but over here in Australia it's definitely a different culture.

A few years back they had a big amnesty here and made it pretty difficult for people to keep guns in their homes. My dad had a really nice Browning .22 that he bought back in the 60s and had hardly used. I would have been worth a bit of money, but he handed it in, otherwise he would have had to purchase a gun locker etc. Hardly worth it for one rifle.

As Grape Ape said, it's 'only' 2 million people, and that's part of the problem I guess. More population, more nutcases. We've only got 20 million people or so, but there's definitely been an increase in violent crime recently thanks to fucked up drugs like Ice.

Also agree on the whole family and upbringing. If there are young kids screwing up then you can't really lock them up and expect the problem to go away. They've GOT to look at the parents and the situation in general.

But then that's a whole other can o' worms...

Posted by: Grape Ape

Bad parenting is an issue, but not so much about gun crimes as in general. Gun crimes are usually committed either on people the perp knew OR people who got their guns illegally to begin with, and would continue to get illegally even if we allowed our government to take away that right.

By the way... D.C. has had one of the highest gun murder rates in the nation since the yr they banned guns. And one of the worst crime rates in general. It has been #1 for murders numerous times since the 80's.

Posted by: Slow Nova

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grape Ape


	Bad parenting is an issue, but not so much about gun crimes as in general. Gun crimes are usually committed either on people the perp knew OR people who got their guns illegally to begin with, and would continue to get illegally even if we allowed our government to take away that right. By the way... D.C. has had one of the highest gun murder rates in the nation since the yr they banned guns. And one of the worst crime rates in general. It has been #1 for murders numerous times since the 80's.

"Sitting Ducks"

Not able to own a firearm for personal protection - yet the criminals have access to just about any firearms they want. That's just something that the Anti's (ie: Brady's, Feinstien, Newsom, etc.) will never fully grasp.

Gavin Newsom recently stated that L.A. had a great law that prohibited the sale of ammo immediatly prior to and during certain holidays, like Independance Day or New Years. I don't see how that logic works. Ammo doesn't expire in a week or so. Many people have 100's, if not 1,000's of rounds of ammo at home.

Recently, one of my father-in-laws co-workers was murdered along with his 2 sons because of road rage (google "Anthony Bologna"). The murderer suspect is an admitted gang member. The strict California gun laws did absolutely nothing to prevent him from illegally aquiring and carrying a loaded firearm.

Posted by: Grape Ape

That's just a sad story. The person who committed those crimes deserves to be hanged by the toes and beaten to death.

Posted by: GT-Treb

I try to be open-minded and study both sides of an argument. After studying the gun control issues I have to say that I
now support gun control because...

1. Banning guns works, which is why New York, DC, Detroit & Chicago cops need guns.

2. Washington DC's low murder rate of 69 per 100,000 is due to strict gun control, and Indianapolis' high murder rate of 9 per 100,000 is due to the lack of gun control.

3. Statistics showing high murder rates justify gun control but statistics showing increasing murder rates after gun control are "just statistics."

4. The Brady Bill and the Assault Weapons Ban, both of which went into effect in 1994 are responsible for the decrease in violent crime rates, which have been declining since 1991.

5. We must get rid of guns because a deranged lunatic may go on a shooting spree at any time and anyone who would own a gun out of fear of such a lunatic is paranoid.

6. The more helpless you are the safer you are from criminals.

7. An intruder will be incapacitated by tear gas or oven spray, but if shot with a .357 Magnum will get angry and kill you.

8. A woman raped and strangled is morally superior to a woman with a smoking gun and a dead rapist at her feet.

9. When confronted by violent criminals, you should "put up no defense - give them what they want, or run" (Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Pete Shields, Guns Don't Die - People Do, 1981, p. 125).

10. The New England Journal of Medicine is filled with expert advice about guns; just like Guns & Ammo has some excellent treatises on heart surgery.

11. One should consult an automotive engineer for safer seat belts, a civil engineer for a better bridge, a surgeon for internal medicine, a computer programmer for hard drive problems, and Sarah Brady for firearms expertise.

12. The 2nd Amendment, ratified in 1787, refers to the National Guard, which was created 130 years later, in 1917.

13. The National Guard, federally funded, with bases on federal land, using federally-owned weapons, vehicles, buildings and uniforms, punishing trespassers under federal law, is a "state" militia.

14. These phrases: "right of the people peaceably to assemble," "right of the people to be secure in their homes," "enumerations herein of certain rights shall not be construed to disparage others retained by the people," and "The powers not delegated herein are reserved to the states respectively, and to the people" all refer to individuals, but "the right of the people to keep and bear arms" refers to the state.

15. "The Constitution is strong and will never change." But we should ban and seize all guns thereby violating the 2nd, 4th, and 5th Amendments to that Constitution.

16. Rifles and handguns aren't necessary to national defense! Of course, the army has hundreds of thousands of them.

17. Private citizens shouldn't have handguns, because they aren't "military weapons', but private citizens shouldn't have "assault rifles', because they are military weapons.

18. In spite of waiting periods, background checks, fingerprinting, government forms, etc., guns today are too readily available, which is responsible for recent school shootings. In the 1940's, 1950's and 1960's, anyone could buy guns at hardware stores, army surplus stores, gas stations, variety stores, Sears mail order, no waiting, no background check, no fingerprints, no government forms and there were no school shootings.

19. The NRA's attempt to run a "don't touch" campaign about kids handling guns is propaganda, but the anti-gun lobby's attempt to run a "don't touch" campaign is responsible social activity.

20. Guns are so complex that special training is necessary to use them properly, and so simple to use that they make murder easy.

21. A handgun, with up to 4 controls, is far too complex for the typical adult to learn to use, as opposed to an automobile that only has 20.

22. Women are just as intelligent and capable as men but a woman with a gun is "an accident waiting to happen" and gun makers' advertisements aimed at women are "preying on their fears."

23. Ordinary people in the presence of guns turn into slaughtering butchers but revert to normal when the weapon is removed.

24. Guns cause violence, which is why there are so many mass killings at gun shows.

25. A majority of the population supports gun control, just like a majority of the population supported owning slaves.

26. Any self-loading small arm can legitimately be considered to be a "weapon of mass destruction" or an "assault weapon."

27. Most people can't be trusted, so we should have laws against guns, which most people will abide by because they can be trusted.

28. The right of Internet pornographers to exist cannot be questioned because it is constitutionally protected by the Bill of Rights, but the use of handguns for self defense is not really protected by the Bill of Rights.

29. Free speech entitles one to own newspapers, transmitters, computers, and typewriters, but self- defense only justifies bare hands.

30. The ACLU is good because it uncompromisingly defends certain parts of the Constitution, and the NRA is bad, because it defends other parts of the Constitution.

31. Charlton Heston, a movie actor as president of the NRA is a cheap lunatic who should be ignored, but Michael Douglas, a movie actor as a representative of Handgun Control, Inc. is an ambassador for peace who is entitled to an audience at the UN arms control summit.

32. Police operate with backup within groups, which is why they need larger capacity pistol magazines than do "civilians" who must face criminals alone and therefore need less ammunition.

33. We should ban "Saturday Night Specials" and other inexpensive guns because it's not fair that poor people have access to guns too.

34. Police officers have some special Jedi-like mastery over handguns that private citizens can never hope to obtain.

35. Private citizens don't need a gun for self- protection because the police are there to protect them even though the Supreme Court says the police are not responsible for their protection.

36. Citizens don't need to carry a gun for personal protection but police chiefs, who are desk-bound administrators who work in a building filled with cops, need a gun.

37. "Assault weapons" have no purpose other than to kill large numbers of people. The police need assault weapons. You do not.

38. When Microsoft pressures its distributors to give Microsoft preferential promotion, that's bad; but when the Federal government pressures cities to buy guns only from Smith & Wesson, that's good.

39. Trigger locks do not interfere with the ability to use a gun for defensive purposes, which is why you see police officers with one on their duty weapon.

40. Handgun Control, Inc., says they want to "keep guns out of the wrong hands." Guess what? You have the wrong hands.

Posted by: KingofSlackers

that's pretty good

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